EP 638 Wine tasting at CRU Restaurant in NYC – Part 2

CRU’s Robert Bohr and Gary Vaynerchuk get philosophical about Rosso di Montalcino and Burgundy, and even taste a 1980 vintage red from the great Domaine Dujac.

Wines tasted in this episode:

2006 Casanuove delle Cerbaie Rosso di Montalcino
1980 Dujac Clos de la Roche

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Luca Bercelli

90/100

line of the day -‘there’s no stinky cow manure, someone pooped in my face action’

Sound is better in this second half and definitely an interesting show, but I found it funny that Gary agreed with his guest who said that the barnyard aspect of many Burgundy wines was due to bad hygiene or semi-spoiled wine. I’m sure Gary has come across this characteristic on numerous occasions but has usually enjoyed it and not attributed it to any kind of contamination. (But then again my memory is terrible!)

Tags: Clos de la Roche, cru, France, Italian, red, review, Rosso di Montalcino, Video, wine, wines

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  • Derek Richards

    QOTD: I agree with some of the other comments that there is room for both just because there has to be though. Wine should reflect the unique process and location from whenst it came. Good vintage or bad. It’s like when I used to collect baseball cards..those crappy packs in between made my awesome packs with a cool insert card or RC that much COOLER. See the analogy?

    Loved the 2 parter..lets drink, grow, and explore.

  • Derek Richards

    QOTD: I agree with some of the other comments that there is room for both just because there has to be though. Wine should reflect the unique process and location from whenst it came. Good vintage or bad. It’s like when I used to collect baseball cards..those crappy packs in between made my awesome packs with a cool insert card or RC that much COOLER. See the analogy?

    Loved the 2 parter..lets drink, grow, and explore.

  • Jeff J

    QOTD: For me, even as a relatively inexperienced and uneducated wine drinker, I absolutely want wine with identity. I don’t really expect myself to taste a wine and be able to sense the terroir in the large sense of the word, but I absolutely do want to be taste wines that are representative of where they came from both in geography and in wine making tradition. I agree with other posts about the ability for winemakers to evolve rather than being bound by iron-clad rules, but tradition has its place and should be respected. I find it extremely boring and disappointing when I drink a wine everybody raves about and it is nothing but a clone of whatever other big, impressive tasting (at first) wine there is around. Wines need a sense of place – there needs to be something it a wine that is unique to that one producer and year – for me that is where a lot of the beauty comes from, and I’ll seek it out.

  • Jeff J

    QOTD: For me, even as a relatively inexperienced and uneducated wine drinker, I absolutely want wine with identity. I don’t really expect myself to taste a wine and be able to sense the terroir in the large sense of the word, but I absolutely do want to be taste wines that are representative of where they came from both in geography and in wine making tradition. I agree with other posts about the ability for winemakers to evolve rather than being bound by iron-clad rules, but tradition has its place and should be respected. I find it extremely boring and disappointing when I drink a wine everybody raves about and it is nothing but a clone of whatever other big, impressive tasting (at first) wine there is around. Wines need a sense of place – there needs to be something it a wine that is unique to that one producer and year – for me that is where a lot of the beauty comes from, and I’ll seek it out.

  • J Crazy

    I would rather have winemakers shoot for typicity in the vineyard and deliciousness in the blending, winemaking side. I think that fruit picks up the typicality, terroir, sense of origin in the vineyard. So don’t kill the soils with a bunch of chemicals, don’t kill off all living organisms with shit that will leave you with simply wine vines and not a vineYARD. Once you have the best fruit, picked specifically for a certain hill or plot or whatever half your job is done. Once the fruit is picked at optimum timing and arrives in buckets just don’t f’ck it up. Don’t add a bunch of super purple, don’t cream oak all over it, just let it be. I don’t want to drink Frankenstein’s Monster wines that are cut open, ripped apart, put back together with the aim of creating a certain flavor profile year after year, bottling after bottling and NO winemaking region in the world is free from these Wine “Doctors”.

    Go organic, go biodynamic, get your land to the best possible shape it is, grow the best fruit and get it into a bottle. Mmmmmm typicity is delicious.

  • J Crazy

    I would rather have winemakers shoot for typicity in the vineyard and deliciousness in the blending, winemaking side. I think that fruit picks up the typicality, terroir, sense of origin in the vineyard. So don’t kill the soils with a bunch of chemicals, don’t kill off all living organisms with shit that will leave you with simply wine vines and not a vineYARD. Once you have the best fruit, picked specifically for a certain hill or plot or whatever half your job is done. Once the fruit is picked at optimum timing and arrives in buckets just don’t f’ck it up. Don’t add a bunch of super purple, don’t cream oak all over it, just let it be. I don’t want to drink Frankenstein’s Monster wines that are cut open, ripped apart, put back together with the aim of creating a certain flavor profile year after year, bottling after bottling and NO winemaking region in the world is free from these Wine “Doctors”.

    Go organic, go biodynamic, get your land to the best possible shape it is, grow the best fruit and get it into a bottle. Mmmmmm typicity is delicious.

  • MaRc

    Awesome question!
    QOTD: Keep the tradition! If I’m able to, I would love to taste the difference between a 60’s or 70’s bottle of wine vs a 90’s to the current vintages. So much technology has been put into play that sometimes, the ‘purity’ of the fruit is not at its peak.
    Besides, what makes the wine special is its terroir, winemaking, grape varieties and tradition! New world wines put name of grapes (which undeniably makes label reading easier) on their bottles, however old world style don’t because that’s what they are.
    Lastly, I definately would advocate for tradition to extract the trueness of the wine and not to please the palate of super-tasters for marketing/economic purposes.

  • MaRc

    Awesome question!
    QOTD: Keep the tradition! If I’m able to, I would love to taste the difference between a 60’s or 70’s bottle of wine vs a 90’s to the current vintages. So much technology has been put into play that sometimes, the ‘purity’ of the fruit is not at its peak.
    Besides, what makes the wine special is its terroir, winemaking, grape varieties and tradition! New world wines put name of grapes (which undeniably makes label reading easier) on their bottles, however old world style don’t because that’s what they are.
    Lastly, I definately would advocate for tradition to extract the trueness of the wine and not to please the palate of super-tasters for marketing/economic purposes.

  • Jason S.

    QOTD: I firmly believe in terror. But why can’t you have your cake and eat it too? Why can’t wines have a sense of place and also be delicious? Every wine has its place and time – there’s no reason to try to make everything the same. All you’ll end up with is boring wine.

  • Jason S.

    QOTD: I firmly believe in terror. But why can’t you have your cake and eat it too? Why can’t wines have a sense of place and also be delicious? Every wine has its place and time – there’s no reason to try to make everything the same. All you’ll end up with is boring wine.

  • Ken T

    Keep true the tradition of the land from which the wine is made. No artificial help.

  • Ken T

    Keep true the tradition of the land from which the wine is made. No artificial help.

  • sargieAZ

    Great 2 parter Gary- loved it! Almost as much as the Nicolas Joly episodes.
    QOTD: YES- I want there to be sense of place and regional typicity! Otherwise all wines taste the same, what would be the point?

    Definitely- stick to those traditions but go ahead and use better hygene methods.

  • sargieAZ

    Great 2 parter Gary- loved it! Almost as much as the Nicolas Joly episodes.
    QOTD: YES- I want there to be sense of place and regional typicity! Otherwise all wines taste the same, what would be the point?

    Definitely- stick to those traditions but go ahead and use better hygene methods.

  • Great QOTD: I’m going to start by saying that I’m big into beer as well as wine. One thing that I miss in the wine world that the beer people are big on are style guidelines. Now, just because there are guidelines for a style doesn’t mean that a beer slightly off style won’t be amazing, it does mean that it will be remeniscent. I’m all for maintaining a sense of place and style within different wine regions. If you happen to not like a certain style (after trying it multiple different times, from different producers, from different vintages), so be it. You don’t have to like every style. But there are going to be people who will rep that style as their favorite until the day they die. Keep styles alive.

  • Jay

    Great QOTD: I’m going to start by saying that I’m big into beer as well as wine. One thing that I miss in the wine world that the beer people are big on are style guidelines. Now, just because there are guidelines for a style doesn’t mean that a beer slightly off style won’t be amazing, it does mean that it will be remeniscent. I’m all for maintaining a sense of place and style within different wine regions. If you happen to not like a certain style (after trying it multiple different times, from different producers, from different vintages), so be it. You don’t have to like every style. But there are going to be people who will rep that style as their favorite until the day they die. Keep styles alive.

  • QUE

    QOTD: I think the best possible wine should be made regueardless of the area or tradition. If you think about it isn’t that what started those traditional areas anyway? That may mean that there are wines made in areas and in styles that do not reflect the “normal” or expected. But really these regions they are all pretty new compared to wine making itself. The AOC started in 1855, that isn’t that long ago. The DOC also has very little history in the grand scheame of things that is wine and wine making (think Roman times).

    Chianti: think of what is being produced at the moment under the Chianti name. However, not long ago this meant that there were some white wines added, there had to be for it to be labeled Chianti. Now this is not the case. Some of the most amazing wines coming out of Tuscany are Super Tuscans (these wines started from cab sav vines from Lafite by Sassicaias). They are not indigenous to the area or history. Is this wrong? I would say, no. I think the wine maker and or vineyard manager got together and found something that worked well. Then they produced the best product they could and suddenly you have an amazing wine that would have been missed if they would have stuck to the laws and tradition.

    To me what is tradition? If everyone stuck with tradition we would be drinking nasty, cloudy, acidic, still wines and calling them Champagne.

    Everything always changes. It is unstoppable. I say make sure it only changes for the better.

  • QUE

    QOTD: I think the best possible wine should be made regueardless of the area or tradition. If you think about it isn’t that what started those traditional areas anyway? That may mean that there are wines made in areas and in styles that do not reflect the “normal” or expected. But really these regions they are all pretty new compared to wine making itself. The AOC started in 1855, that isn’t that long ago. The DOC also has very little history in the grand scheame of things that is wine and wine making (think Roman times).

    Chianti: think of what is being produced at the moment under the Chianti name. However, not long ago this meant that there were some white wines added, there had to be for it to be labeled Chianti. Now this is not the case. Some of the most amazing wines coming out of Tuscany are Super Tuscans (these wines started from cab sav vines from Lafite by Sassicaias). They are not indigenous to the area or history. Is this wrong? I would say, no. I think the wine maker and or vineyard manager got together and found something that worked well. Then they produced the best product they could and suddenly you have an amazing wine that would have been missed if they would have stuck to the laws and tradition.

    To me what is tradition? If everyone stuck with tradition we would be drinking nasty, cloudy, acidic, still wines and calling them Champagne.

    Everything always changes. It is unstoppable. I say make sure it only changes for the better.

  • kdawg

    great pair of shows. Its a lot of fun to see a good 1980 Burg get popped, it’s my birthyear as well

    QOTD: You’d better believe that I want a wine to taste of where it came from. All of the best wines that I’ve had bring their own quirks and their own sense of where they are from. Its not just the best wines either that do that for me, I had a 04 Rocca Delle Macie CCR that was just everything you’d want from sangiovese and it just pushed my buttons in all the right places.

    While there are good wines made that have an international profile, For me, its a neccessity that it keeps its varietal characteristics and regional characteristics. Wine is one of the few things in the world that can evoke thoughts of a place that you’ve never been and give you a sense of what that place may be like. When you take that away, you take some of the romance and fun out of wine

  • kdawg

    great pair of shows. Its a lot of fun to see a good 1980 Burg get popped, it’s my birthyear as well

    QOTD: You’d better believe that I want a wine to taste of where it came from. All of the best wines that I’ve had bring their own quirks and their own sense of where they are from. Its not just the best wines either that do that for me, I had a 04 Rocca Delle Macie CCR that was just everything you’d want from sangiovese and it just pushed my buttons in all the right places.

    While there are good wines made that have an international profile, For me, its a neccessity that it keeps its varietal characteristics and regional characteristics. Wine is one of the few things in the world that can evoke thoughts of a place that you’ve never been and give you a sense of what that place may be like. When you take that away, you take some of the romance and fun out of wine

  • A dumb Rhine king

    QOTD: I like tradition, but I also enjoy the choice to do what you want. To me it would be best to do both, mostly tradition, but some non-traditional to pay the bills and have some flippin fun!

  • A dumb Rhine king

    QOTD: I like tradition, but I also enjoy the choice to do what you want. To me it would be best to do both, mostly tradition, but some non-traditional to pay the bills and have some flippin fun!

  • Tom T.

    Poop in your face? LOL another WLTV classic. QOTD definitely more traditional.

  • Tom T.

    Poop in your face? LOL another WLTV classic. QOTD definitely more traditional.

  • pete C

    Great guest. QOTD- no McDonaldization of wine, thank you!

  • pete C

    Great guest. QOTD- no McDonaldization of wine, thank you!

  • The Lurk Monster

    A few episodes back I was left with a very bad taste in my mouth from that sleazy, fake, ignorant, awkward and rude guest that was only there to promote his book. Taking advantage of people is not the way to go.

    This may be one of my favorite male guests. (Joanne from Rocketboom was unreal.) This guy was genuine, knowledgeable, humble and interesting. It is always nice to see such people in the wine industry.

    QOTD: Wine should stay true to its roots. Just like people, be yourself and do the best you can.

  • The Lurk Monster

    A few episodes back I was left with a very bad taste in my mouth from that sleazy, fake, ignorant, awkward and rude guest that was only there to promote his book. Taking advantage of people is not the way to go.

    This may be one of my favorite male guests. (Joanne from Rocketboom was unreal.) This guy was genuine, knowledgeable, humble and interesting. It is always nice to see such people in the wine industry.

    QOTD: Wine should stay true to its roots. Just like people, be yourself and do the best you can.

  • Vada

    QOTD: I love to explore wines and discover their DNA. That requires wines made true to their origins. An extreme examples would be Chris Carpenter’s Lokoya Cabs. Sometimes I’m just thirsty and want something familiar.

  • Vada

    QOTD: I love to explore wines and discover their DNA. That requires wines made true to their origins. An extreme examples would be Chris Carpenter’s Lokoya Cabs. Sometimes I’m just thirsty and want something familiar.

  • innA

    A great show – I had it on my list of places to go, but never made it around to Cru when I was in NYC.

    QOTD – definitely has to be a sense of place!

  • innA

    A great show – I had it on my list of places to go, but never made it around to Cru when I was in NYC.

    QOTD – definitely has to be a sense of place!

  • Tom P

    Interestin show, I like to see the wine world from the business side and how a restauranteer sees it. Although clearly Robert is much more deeply involved that just serving wines out of Cru.

    QOTD – Variety is the spice of life. Wine to me is something to be explored and therefore each region brings something to try.

  • Tom P

    Interestin show, I like to see the wine world from the business side and how a restauranteer sees it. Although clearly Robert is much more deeply involved that just serving wines out of Cru.

    QOTD – Variety is the spice of life. Wine to me is something to be explored and therefore each region brings something to try.

  • Jameus

    Great 2-part show guys! Listening to you two chit-chat about wine and roots was awesome! It also makes me realize that wine is such a life long passion! I can read about regions and classifications all day long and still know so little about wine. I love that aspect of wine and wine culture! The entire process, the more I learn of it, just becomes more and more interesting.

    QOTD: I love trying different wines from different areas of the world BECAUSE they are unique(at least some of them anyways)! I know through science and technique winemakers are able to drastically modify the results but imo it’s masking the true terroir insignificant. However unless people educate themselves and taste as many different wines as possible they won’t know they enjoy barrossa shyraz over a cali zin.

  • Jameus

    Great 2-part show guys! Listening to you two chit-chat about wine and roots was awesome! It also makes me realize that wine is such a life long passion! I can read about regions and classifications all day long and still know so little about wine. I love that aspect of wine and wine culture! The entire process, the more I learn of it, just becomes more and more interesting.

    QOTD: I love trying different wines from different areas of the world BECAUSE they are unique(at least some of them anyways)! I know through science and technique winemakers are able to drastically modify the results but imo it’s masking the true terroir insignificant. However unless people educate themselves and taste as many different wines as possible they won’t know they enjoy barrossa shyraz over a cali zin.

  • Bruce

    Shout out to Mott. One of the best shot episodes ever. Great angle on the bottles and glasses while leaving the peeps fully viewable. More like this, thanks.
    As for the wine: make it like it is, where it is.

  • Bruce

    Shout out to Mott. One of the best shot episodes ever. Great angle on the bottles and glasses while leaving the peeps fully viewable. More like this, thanks.
    As for the wine: make it like it is, where it is.

  • Matlock the Burgundian

    I have my Sotheby’s out, reading about these wines, and am completely jealous that I’m not there drinking with you.

    QOTD: YES, I think regions and traditions need to stick. Some of these wines have been developed over hundreds of years. We shouldn’t be so quick to throw those aside because the ‘coca-cola’ generations don’t enjoy anything but easy, fruity, grape-juiced wine. Just take a look at what’s happened to the quality beer world, specifically Belgium and Lambics. Traditions and regional integrity was given up for easy drinkability and the chance to snaq the sweet-toothed drinker (friends with the Oak monster?) The reason that ‘Majority America’ only knows about Bud, Coors, and Miller (Pilsner Lager style) is for this very reason; traditions and VARIETY were given up. Wine shouldn’t make the same mistake.

  • J Mize

    QOTD: I want wines to taste true to there place in the world, while maintaining a high level of quality. If too many wines try to taste like a Barossa Shiraz then what is the point! My favorite guest on the show of all time! Thanks GV and Robert!

  • Matlock the Burgundian

    I have my Sotheby’s out, reading about these wines, and am completely jealous that I’m not there drinking with you.

    QOTD: YES, I think regions and traditions need to stick. Some of these wines have been developed over hundreds of years. We shouldn’t be so quick to throw those aside because the ‘coca-cola’ generations don’t enjoy anything but easy, fruity, grape-juiced wine. Just take a look at what’s happened to the quality beer world, specifically Belgium and Lambics. Traditions and regional integrity was given up for easy drinkability and the chance to snaq the sweet-toothed drinker (friends with the Oak monster?) The reason that ‘Majority America’ only knows about Bud, Coors, and Miller (Pilsner Lager style) is for this very reason; traditions and VARIETY were given up. Wine shouldn’t make the same mistake.

  • J Mize

    QOTD: I want wines to taste true to there place in the world, while maintaining a high level of quality. If too many wines try to taste like a Barossa Shiraz then what is the point! My favorite guest on the show of all time! Thanks GV and Robert!

  • M

    QOTD: TRADITION

    I cringe when I see people buying juice that is not traditional wine in my mind. Black Box, Sutter Home, Vella, Franzia, Yellowtail, Barefoot, Almaden. I want Gevrey Chambertin, Vacqueyras, Piedmont, etc………… I live in PA and luckily it’s not far to Delaware or New Jersey to find “good” wine from around the world.

  • M

    QOTD: TRADITION

    I cringe when I see people buying juice that is not traditional wine in my mind. Black Box, Sutter Home, Vella, Franzia, Yellowtail, Barefoot, Almaden. I want Gevrey Chambertin, Vacqueyras, Piedmont, etc………… I live in PA and luckily it’s not far to Delaware or New Jersey to find “good” wine from around the world.

  • Brian

    QOTD: I must say that I like to taste the terrior in the wine. So, I want the winemakers to remain faithful to that ideal.

    Great episode.

  • Brian

    QOTD: I must say that I like to taste the terrior in the wine. So, I want the winemakers to remain faithful to that ideal.

    Great episode.

  • Cameron J

    QOTD: I want wines that reflect terroir and tradition. Otherwise, I hardly see the point of making wine or drinking wine. I may not like certain grapes, regions, styles, but I want to be able to try them over time. I want variety and a sense of place in my wine consumption.

  • Cameron J

    QOTD: I want wines that reflect terroir and tradition. Otherwise, I hardly see the point of making wine or drinking wine. I may not like certain grapes, regions, styles, but I want to be able to try them over time. I want variety and a sense of place in my wine consumption.

  • cthomasc

    QOTD: If wines all became the same old monotonous fruit juice with no character, I’d quit drinking them. Keep traditions alive!

    Cheers

  • cthomasc

    QOTD: If wines all became the same old monotonous fruit juice with no character, I’d quit drinking them. Keep traditions alive!

    Cheers

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