EP 862 Cinderella Wine in the Spotlight- Tasting the Most Talked About Wines

Gary Vaynerchuk retastes three different wines that were some of the most loved and controversial from Wine Library’s sister site, Cinderella Wine

Wines tasted in this episode:

2006 Alain Jaume Lirac Clos De SixteLirac
2005 Les Cretes Coteau La Tour Valle d’Aosta
2005 Gran Elias Mora ToroSpanish Red Wine

Links mentioned in todays episode.

Latest Comment:

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luca bercelli


Really enjoyable show. I can’t make my mind up about this one. On the one hand GV has to try the second wine seven times (!) in order to justify not panning it. Surely he’d understand what was going on with his usual 2 sips. On the other hand he is very convincing about why it appeals to his (unusual) palette. I’ve got a hunch that it probably sucks and I’m definitely not rushing out to buy it. I doubt if he ever drunk it again after this show.

Tags: Lirac, red, review, Spanish, Video, wine, wines

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  • John_Kenneth_J

    qotd: What do you drink 1st, an aged, old red wine, or a new young wine?
    I've had this discussion with fellow wine stewards, sommelier's, wine reps, etc. Looked in books including the study guides for the top wine schools in the world and other leading, serious, wine books. To what was my surprise and according to what some of these study guides even along with other fellow wino's say, the new wine should be drunk 1st. Now lets assume we're talking about 2 of the exact same wines, say from Bordeaux, except one is 20 years older than the other. I say drink the older one 1st. The older one should be more ready to drink (according to popular opinion, and mine as well), much more complex, some of the tannins will have fallen out of the wine as sediment, thus making the wine smoother, softer, and giving it slightly less body, and the wine should be better integrated over all. Now if you start with the younger one 1st you're probably going to get a wine that is much more tannic, tighter, less complex, with a little bit more body.
    Do you really want to start with that younger wine, that's more tannic, not as elegant, not as smooth, and then follow it with a wine that is more complex and elegant after you've had a tighter more tannic wine coating your taste buds? Not to mention if you're drinking it you've ingested more alcohol, and are therefore drunker, which will take away from your ability to assess and pick up on the complexity and nuances of the wine's taste. Add to that the ability to assess the wine's ever evolving bouquet as it opens? Let's say your pairing food, you'd figure the more bolder tannic wine would go after a wine less tannic and you'd save that one for the main course, while saving the less tannic, softer wine for a lighter dish.
    I may be missing something, but the only reason I can think of to try the younger wine 1st and the older one last, is because you want to save the best for last. Even though your palate from the younger wine and the ingested alcohol will likely hinder your ability to appreciate it.

  • dsallen

    That is why I hate sharing my wine. And, MAJOR dislike to unappreciative friends/consumers.

  • John_Kenneth_J

    Oh and Gary, we haven't seen SIR Gary Vaynerchuk for quite a while now, perhaps you can coax him into making another appearance?

  • Illegal_Formation

    Agreed. If wine was meant to be shared, the bottles would be bigger.

  • JohnsGSD

    Very interesting show G. “…don't need implants in your ass…” lol. Love it.

    Right now, my friends all love Aussie shiraz. I just can't wrap my head around it. It's just too much for me, over the top, missing the interesting subtleties you talk about, and the %ABV is ridiculous. 15+% for Marquis Phillips S2?!?! Bleh.

    – John D.

  • How I wish I would have bought that three pack… oh well.

    QOTD: it's been a long time since anyone has had a serious conversation about a particular wine, we mostly just drink them with our meals pointing out differences in personal tastes but not much else, however I do remember in 2002 I was part of a dinner discussion about Navarro Correas cabernet that went up in color until we ran out (4 bottles), it started with someone saying that an advert pointed to how amazing those wines were and most of us (including the host) just though of them as adequate table wines except a couple that ranted all night about how they had the best experience in the matter when in fact they had no real knowledge just random wine purchases from the wine of the month club from a local store. I still think of those wines as adequate and not surprising nor exciting, good and that's it.

  • Karl

    Hello Gary,
    I have been watching the show for two years now and am a very big fan. This is the first time time I have written. I am from Cleveland, OH and just got done watching the Cavs play against the Celtics. I live in Portland, OR and am a new striving winemaker with hopes of opening the first urban winery in Cleveland. I wanted to write after watching the Cavs take my heart with them once again in Cleveland fashion for the 30th time in my years of life. As a Jets fan and a extremely great wine fan I just wanted to share my sorrows in the loss with you as I walked home and now sharing a nice Mendoza, Malbec 2008 Trivento Reserve. Thanks Gary for your years of knowledge and fun, enjoyable enthusiasm that makes me happy to be striving in the winemaking industry.
    Best regards to you and your family

  • I picked up the 07 Jaume Lirac Clos de Sixte that rated 93 Parker for $13.99. Cmon Cindy!

  • Just Jack

    oops inadvertent post in the wrong spot. I was replying to someone and the next thing you know it showed up as a new post. Drank a bit too much Yellow Tail I guess (just kidding folks, don't have a coronary).

  • Just Jack

    Good question JKJ. I think you are absolutely right. You don't have to take my word for it though. Take a gander at Robert Parker starting at 1:47 in episode 780. The next time someone tells you to start with the young monster play that for them and it should settle the debate. I have just always assumed that is the way it should be done. Having said that, I have not been to a lot of formal tastings or master tastings with vertical flights and all of that so I am no expert on the protocol. I am curious. When you say you have had the discussion with lots of folks in the industry, are many of them advocating the young wine first? That would suprise me.

  • Thanks for doing the show, I'm still pumped for the Les Cretes. That's why we buy from Gary…TO EXPAND OUR PALATES. I can buy an over the top fruity cab down the street.

    QOTD: Charles Shaw Merlot. Friends from college still swear it's better than anything else under $20. I think it tastes like a foot.

  • Allan

    If i know the G-man it's a pazzzzz, at that price point.

  • Allan


  • Allan

    Yellow Tail is not that bad,,,,,,,, oh wait….
    Yes it is!!!

    ; )

  • Just Jack

    WOOT. Another lurker heard from. Welcome to the family Karl. Kick off your shoes, grab a spot on the couch and relax a while. As a very long time lurker myself I can tell you it is much more fun when you get to participate. It's kind of like sex in that regard. You can just watch if want, but for my palate (I know there are exceptions) it is much more fun to be part of the action. Although sometimes I do get a little bit of a sore spot where wifey…oh, wait, sorry there folks I lost track of where I was for a second. It's ok, I'm back now. In any event welcome Karl.

  • Just Jack


  • Just Jack

    And no, the sore spot is not from a** implants. Where in G*d's green earth did you pull that out of Gary.

  • Corkshack

    GREAT show Gary! I know I don't comment enough, but this one brought me out! I love when the shows have “nuances” as well. I like called K-Murph in, when you “arg” like a pirate and then realize you sounded like and idiot, when Mott awkwardly smells the black pepper. I think it all boils down to keeping the videos fresh. That's exactly what you were doing with the new free shipping vids…love em! I was one of the first peeps to give you a hard time WAY back when Cindy first launched about doing a few cindy vids….please don't let this be the last.

    I looked into Southwest flights to NYC for your party in July, but right now Sacramento to NYC is wayyyy to expensive. You should have some kind of competition with your fans where you buy their flight to come to the party if they win a contest. Maybe anyone that buys a certain day of cindy wine is automatically in a drawing for a sponsored trip to the party! That would be a killer idea! People would go nuts over that!

    Keep up the good work. The most controversial wine amongst my friends and family is actually the 2002 Mt. Cass pinot from New Zealand. Bought it a couple times from you. I LOVE the “funk” factor…but I can see why it may not be a popular pic. Its the girl with a freckle and a pirate scar!

    Corkshack (Chris A)

  • Thanks Gary for sharing these “special” wine. I love to debate on unusual wines. The most controversial was a 1932 Riesling. By far the oldest I've ever drank, but so different in its “flavors”, this wine splitts the table!

  • Corkshack

    Pretty sure Gary was a little tipsy. If that's the secret to a great show, he should always have a few before taping!

    Corkshack (Chris A)

  • john

    You are correct, would GV be pumped for this wine at $49 with all the metaphors he used to describe this wine ….. NOT !!!!!!! He was totally trying to save face, he just can't admit it. Would he ever purchase a wine that 98% of the people would not like the favor profile of? … NO !!! He basically blew a purchase and is trying to save the implants. You can see right through the salesman in him on this one.

  • andreparsons

    Great show Gary! I only wish I could get some of the wines you introduce in Japan!

  • Anonymous

    you are right. So it’ll be a PaZZZZ for me too.

  • Anonymous

    Haha, it?s funny how you put it. But you know it is difficult form where he is sitting. We?ve watched the shows for so many years. We can read between the lines from what he said. GV took so many sips and was going back and forth introducing the flavor profiles. GV changed it from 89-91 to 88-89 points. Maybe when Jets lost that is 83 points wine or even 79 points because there isn?t any yummy factor?

  • Oakmon's BF

    Mott, at 9:18 Gary called you a ?Jets? fan. Any comment?

  • Altboy97

    We've moved to NJ in the last year from California and find that SW is typically not the lowest fare (as you come to assume living in CA). Check Cont or United via one of the internet travel services, and also the option of coming into EWR (much closer to WL).

  • Altboy97

    Great episode. I got the three pack of the Lirac Clos De Sixte and I loved the first bottle. Thanks for the heads up on the La Tour (which I also picked up). I think you right in that expectations have a lot to do with it. Now I know to moderate my expectations and start with an open mind, rather than expecting a big, bold Syrah.

  • Richie

    QOTD: Well its aged Rieslings for me and my family. Except an aunt of mine and me they all hate aged Rieslings and wenn I say aged I mean 20 year old Spätlese etc. Not like 4 years or something. They just think Rieslings can't age. Sad really. But the fun part is: I get to drink all the old stuff they have in their cellars.

  • Oakmon's BF

    I was amused by the fact that most of the time he didn?t realize he was doing Wine Library TV. Note at 20:14 ?if this was really, really Wine Library TV ??

  • K is for Kate

    I and all 3 of the friends who shared my bottle of Les Cretes found it at least somewhat enjoyable and definitely interesting. I posted a review over at Cork’d.

    I included the Les Cretes in a tasting of Syrah from different countries. We tried it just after a Saint-Joseph and right before a Havens Syrah and most preferred it to the Havens, even those whose favourite was the Aussie Shiraz, which I thought was interesting given the vast stylistic discrepancy between the two. I thought it drank almost more like a white than a red due to the light body and citrus notes, but that didn’t bother me. Far better that sort of odd character than the overwhelmingly tannic and oak-y Spanish Syrah to my palate. We had it with cheese and crackers and I’d definitely consider it the sort of wine best to be had with food.

  • Allan

    Actually just remembered another controversial bottle……. 1964 Marchesi di Barolo Barolo. It was like a roller-coaster ride the whole way through, an acted quite dead and quite alive all at the same time. Just when you thought it was over, here it comes again…

    Remember The Godfather part 3; “Just when i thought i was out…they pull me back in”. Just like that. ; )


  • jamesculp

    I've been to a couple of tastings where they compare two vintages of the same wine or varietal, and they all started with the younger wine. There may be a good reason, but the only excuse I could figure was so the head taster could explain to you what was missing about the younger one, then they could take you into the older one with the dramatic “Nowwww you will see what happens after a few years of aging!” Oooooh.

    But if you were to start with the older one, you could appreciate on your own what it tastes like, and then, when dealing with the new one, it should be quickly apparent what the differences are. I think that, when yo ustart with the harsher or less nuanced one first, just as you said, it fatigues the pallette and you miss the subtelties of the second.

    So, yeah. I don't get it either.

  • QOTD: Easily the most controversial wine was the 2007 Scholium Project Princes in His Caves Sauvignon Blanc. Weird stuff. Totally grew on me. One other person really liked it. Everyone else thought we were nuts for thinking it was even mildly good.

  • waynooo

    testing……testing…….. WAAAAAAAAAAAHOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • waynooo

    winooooooooo in daaaaaaaaa Hooooooouuuuuuuuussssssseeeee !!!!??!!!!!!!!!!

  • waynooo

    We Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaants daaaaaaa COOOOOOOUUUUUCH !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • waynooo

    And a Bottle o' Vino or Twwwwwooooo !!!!!!!!

  • Cuse WIno

    SO I have my bottle of 2005 Les Cretes Coteau La Tour and don't know if I am now excited or bummed out about trying it. Your review was glowing and killing it at the same time. WIll post again after trying it

    QOTD-Haven't really had any controversial wines, sorry

  • Drinking sparkling wine is not drinking “real” wine. I had to defend myself on a few occasions.

  • Allan

    Sooooo you got the avatar up and runnin'….. nice!

    Yeah let's have a really relazzzzin' friday slurpy-slurp!! ; )

  • Allan

    “Sittin' on a park bench…..”

  • Ooo, coconut sounds very interesting in a wine…

    Ok, I wanted to inquire, have you investigated micro wines, those made in more limited quantities? I know you worked with Crushpad a year or so ago, as am I now (but mine will not be ready for a year or two and I am not going commercial). Most of those wines would not necessarily be Cinderella wines as some are higher priced, but the limited production and the personal touch many of them have is intriguing. Maybe I have missed it, but have you ever reviewed Crushpad (or similar) wines? (other than your own)? Something to think about.

  • angelatcarslon

    Man, the last time I had it, I wanted to scrap off my tongue. Nasty!

  • waynooo

    It's aaaaa Tuuuuuuuuuuufffffffff Liiiiiiife…………….. :O)

  • Oh, controversial wines, no. Different flavors for different folks. The only thing puzzling is when you yourself really like a wine, and then later on try the same exact wine and it is not nearly as good (or bad) as before. Hmm.

  • Redmeat1969

    To bad you cannot ship to Washington State…

  • CharlieTN

    Yes, too bad indeed, as I am moving there next month, putting a sad end to my WL/CW days.

  • Redmeat1969

    QOTD…..El Nido Clio….is one of my top 5 wines….I have a couple buddies who are ..”meh…it's ok …but not too great”

  • mattgmann

    I just had the 07 Clio last weekend. It was kinda 'meh' for me. I remember the 04 being much better.

  • adrums

    Yeah, good call… speaking of which: GV, can we expect your annual Clio Report any time soon?!
    Inquiring palates want to know.


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